Otis Brumby, Bill Kinney, Joe Kirby
That’s when it’s expected that developers will present for the first time at a public forum their concept for a KSU-to-Cumberland-to-Perimeter magnetic-levitatation (“maglev,” for short) rail transit system.
Tony Morris of American Maglev Technology argues that his system would be faster, technologically superior and far less expensive than the tax-burning light rail system now on the table that would connect the MARTA station in Midtown Atlanta with the Cumberland area and, by 2025 or so, with Kennesaw State University and Acworth. Unlike the Maglev proposal, the TSPLOST would not fund a line along the badly congested Cumberland-to-Perimeter arc of Interstate 285.
Morris has said a maglev train could be built for around $20 million per mile, far less than the Federal Transit Administration’s light-rail estimate of $100 million per mile.
Rather than the “steel wheels-on-steel rail” technology employed by railroads, which has a multitude of moving parts and high maintenance costs, a maglev train uses magnetic levitation to elevate the train by 3/8 of an inch over its tracks.
“When it’s lifted up, it’s weightless — you can even push it because there is no friction. It takes the energy equivalent of 15 hairdryers to lift it, so it’s very energy efficient. There’s no resistance, no friction, and it’s essentially like skiing or ice skating down the track,” Morris told the MDJ in a profile last February. “It uses just enough energy for wind resistance, to go up hills, that sort of thing.”
When the train arrives at its destination, it is gently lowered back onto the tracks within a split second. Morris says maglev requires 60 percent less energy to run that a traditional transit rail line. He also claims his system would be much faster, with speeds up to 60 mph. Some critics have noted that based on the expected TSPLOST rail routes and number of stops, the TSPLOST light rail would have an average speed of only 18 mph.
Morris’ company is competing to build maglev lines in San Juan, Puerto Rico, and in Guadalajara, Mexico. Maglev trains have been built in Japan, China and Germany, using a high-tech guideway. AMT would take the opposite (and it claims, less expensive) approach, having “dumb” tracks and putting the magnets and controls in the vehicle.
Morris has hosted a steady stream of political and media types (including most of the Around Town team) at his company’s office on Burrow Trail in the woods along the Thornton Road Connector in Powder Springs, where AMT built a quarter-mile-long track in 2006. The visitors get to see maglev technology in action, complete with a full-scale operational vehicle.
“I’m a Campbell (High School) grad, I grew up in Smyrna, went to school at Georgia Tech, and have been living in Marietta for decades, so this is my home,” Morris told the Journal. “We were very lucky to find a spot that’s been so good to us,” Morris said.
IF THE MAGLEV OPTION withstands scrutiny, it stands to turn the politics of TSPLOST on its head.
Cobb Commission Chairman Tim Lee (who is up for re-election next summer) has “doubled down” in favor of the Midtown-to-Cumberland light rail line favored by the Atlanta Regional Commission and his backers in the Cobb Chamber of Commerce and the Cumberland Improvement District. The lion’s share, or $856.5 million, of Cobb’s expected revenues from the TSPLOST, was originally earmarked for the line. But flack from the public, much of which sees the line as a way of back-dooring MARTA rail into Cobb, and at the expense of badly needed improvements to local roads and expressways, caused Lee to eventually support a plan that shifts $176.5 million from the rail line to various road projects, and which also takes $110 million from the rail line to pay for an upgraded “premium” bus line in the I-75 corridor.
Now Commissioner Ott, who has been sharply critical of Lee and the TSPLOST’s emphasis on the Midtown-to-Atlanta rail, has raised the stakes by, in effect, seeming to throw his support behind the maglev alternative. Not only would it be cheaper (at least as advertised), it also would go where commuting patterns show people are going (i.e., toward the Perimeter/Ga. 400 corridor); as opposed to where Cumberland/Chamber interests wish they were going (toward Atlanta). It also raises the question of why Lee and the Cobb Department of Transportation have shown no apparent interest to date in exploring what appears to be a highly competitive, much less expensive alternative to his TSPLOST rail plan — and a proposal that’s “home-grown,” to boot.
Ott’s town hall will run from 7-9 p.m. The East Cobb Library is at 4880 Lower Roswell Road. For more on American Maglev Technology, go to www.american-maglev.com.
GEORGIA TEA PARTY officials will hold a “No Tax for Tracks” rally on the steps of the state Capitol at noon Saturday. Notes the press release for the event:
“If taxpayers are going to pay $6 billion in taxes, taxpayers should get $6 billion worth in projects that will alleviate traffic congestion. The TSPLOST is a combination of projects, with billions of dollars planned for projects that are not traffic-related.
“The proposed plan will take maintenance and upkeep for years beyond the 10-year plan, requiring extended taxation. This could become a permanent transportation tax!
“Only the most cost-effective projects which deliver the best traffic solutions should have been included on the projects list.”
Speakers are to include frequent MDJ guest columnist Ron Sifen of Vinings, Fayette County Commissioner Steve Brown, Dalton Mayor David Pennington and Tea Party leaders Julianne Thompson and Field Searcy.
POLITICS: The Cobb Elections office is handling polling for three of the five cities that are having elections today, and by coincidence those three — Kennesaw, Powder Springs and Smyrna — all have contested mayoral races on the ballot.
Janine Eveler, director of Cobb Elections, reports that of the three, Smyrna had the most early ballots cast, with 710 voters in that city going to the polls between Oct. 17 and last Friday, during the early/advance voting period.
In Kennesaw, 310 voters have already cast their ballots, and in Powder Springs, 183 voters have done so.
“We don’t really have enough historical data to know if there’s a correlation between a high advance voting turnout and a higher overall turnout,” Eveler told the MDJ. “But if there is a correlation, then Smyrna’s turnout should be almost twice what it was in 2007 and Kennesaw should be about a third less.”
FORMER Cobb Commission Chairman Bill Byrne, who’s running for his old seat again next year, will be guest speaker at Wednesday’s 10:30 a.m. Veterans’ Day memorial at Parkland Manor Independent Senior Community in Austell.
PEOPLE: Davis Webb of Marietta was named Homecoming King on Saturday in Athens, where the Georgia Bulldogs put a 63-16 whuppin’ on New Mexico State. Webb is a graduate of Marietta High, is majoring in Finance and International Affairs at UGA and is due to graduate in December 2012. His sister, Natalie, was crowned Homecoming Queen between the hedges in 2007 and has been traveling the country for Mutual of Omaha, producing and filming its TV commercials. The two are the children of Dr. and Mrs. Randy Webb of Marietta.
THE ANNUAL Cobb County Republican Women’s Club Veteran’s Celebration Brunch will be Nov. 19 at the Marietta Hilton Conference Center and will feature local country music DJ “Moby” as emcee, reports Nancy Bodiford. Keynote speaker will be former Navy SEAL Howard Wasdin, author of “SEAL Team Six.” The social starts at 9 and brunch at 10. Ticket prices are $20 for veterans, $30 for CCRWC members and $35 for guests. For more, call (770) 785-2522. … Veterans are invited to eat free at Dave Poe’s BBQ on Whitlock Ave., on Friday from 11 a.m.- 4 p.m.
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You must be able to see through this tactic.
Both technologies have potential, but in spite of what their developers say, they are very far from deployment ready.
Do you really believe that Commissioner Ott is thinking outsdie of the box? He is smart engough to know crooks and crap when he sees it. Just google Tony J. Morris. What was done is to throw out a little more confusion on the whole transit conversation. Anyone who thinks differently isn't living in reality.
As prior posters said, the vast majority of components (>95%) are pre-existing and in operation. They have been proven to work very well and are not merely theory. They have performance data and production volume cost levels already established. As far as we are aware, Mr Morris' system does not.
You claimed our technology is "based on Futrex". This is incorrect. While our technologies have similarities, they are substantially different, resulting in our being issued multiple patents.
Our company, OTG, Inc., is not asking for taxpayers to fund a HighRoad system. In fact, we have structured a business plan which would minimize risk (ALL technologies have some risk) and create a scenario in which taxpayers ultimately would get the system for little to no cost. The construction project would progress with milestones to be reached before taxpayer dollars are expended. And, those who actually use the system would pay for it.
It should be noted that we will vigorously defend our reputation and the integrity of our technology, whether here or in other venues.
I will not elaborate on the advantages of our system here since that might be interpreted by editors as a violation of their posting standards. However, we believe, like another poster said, that a fair analysis of the technologies will favor HighRoad for a quicker, better solution. May the best technology (and Cobb taxpayers) win!
As prior posters said, the vast majority of components (>95%) are pre-existing and in operation. They have been proven to work very well and are not merely theory. They have performance data and production volume cost levels already established. As far as we are aware, Mr Morris' system does not.
You claimed our technology is "based on Futrex". This is incorrect. While our technologies have similarities, they are substantially different, resulting in our being issued multiple patents.
Our company, OTG, Inc., is not asking for taxpayers to fund a HighRoad system. In fact, we have structured a business plan which would minimize risk (ALL technologies have some risk) and create a scenario in which taxpayers ultimately would get the system for little to no cost. The construction project would progress with milestones to be reached before taxpayer dollars are expended. And, those who actually use the system would pay for it.
It should be noted that we will vigorously defend our reputation and the integrity of our technology, whether here or in other venues.
I will not elaborate on the advantages of our system here since that might be interpreted by editors as a violation of their posting standards. However, we believe, like another poster said, that a fair analysis of the technologies will favor HighRoad for a quicker, better solution. May the best technology (and Cobb taxpayers) win!
Asking us to sink a few hundred million into the unknown of HighRoad (based of course on the Futrex concept that failed), makes just about as much sense as Lee, Reed, and Matthews...along with Tad & Company...holding onto $650million to spend at some point in the future on a totally undefined system and route while begging for federal funds.
Not tested and not built IS a BIG negative.
Unless HighRoad can come up with private financing, there's not much hope for it. I don't see anyway a politician is going to support testing and development on the public dime. That's not how capitalism is supposed to work. Every time...and I mean every time, politicians will default to the tried and true so as to avoid risk in their recommendations. That's why the 19th Century technology of their silly, outrageously expensive trolley is their current choice.
That's where the real problem is with most traditional transit systems.
HighRoad is certainly not traditional, but what are the operations and maintenance costs for such a system and who pays them?
If they truly paid for themselves the fares would be so expensive it wouldn't make sense to ride them. But they don't and that is why they have to be subsidized so heavily.
The questions posed by get real seem legitimate. I looked at the High Road web page and talked with a friend who seems to know the guy who invented it. The reason it hasn't been built is because there's little to nothing left to be proven. It uses parts that are already in existence like the motors, the controls, and so forth. The vendors are substantial players, such as the company that made the Disney vehicles and the biggest high-tech concrete company in the South.
I don't think their not-yet-built status is a negative and it looks like it would offer a LOT more bang for the buck!
If indeed that is the case, there really isn't any reason to not proceed with at least a test loop in actual service. Let Morris prove it will work in real-life service sometime in the next three years. If it does work, and TSPLOST passes, those monies can be redirected to road projects that will truly improve traffic flow issues --- and not spent on a silly trolley that won't run until 2025 at least, won't serve Cobb County to any significant degree, and will require federal funds to do even this...that may not be available. If Morris can't make it work, the County (that's us) isn't out a dime, other than politicians now having access to many millions of dollars sitting in a fund waiting to build a trolley line. (Highly dangerous.)
If TSPLOST doesn't pass, we still have at least evaluated - at no cost to us - a possible transit solution...which is 110% more than ANY of the many studies done on transit to date (costing us many millions) have produced.
Its all a win-win as far as I can see.
BTW: ClearSight.....what is your preferred option? All you have said is you don't think Morris' idea will work. We're all ears.
I especially like the concept that SG68 suggested of having the private sector do this.
That's the ticket!!!
GET REAL!!!
My grandkids can build a pretend transit system with their Thomas the Tank toys.
Unless HighRoad has something more substantial than a paper mache model to offer, please tell them to get out of the way and let the big boys with realistic ideas have the stage so they can offer some real solutions to this critical transportation dilemma.
Now onto the real issue that faces Cobb County.
We need to figure something out and we need to do it sooner rather than later.
Waiting until 2026 ( the optimistic completion date for the Arts Center to Cumberland light rail), to provide one station at the extreme southern end of Cobb County is not sooner.
It is much, much later.
Way to late and way to expensive.
It is certainly not a solution.
His comments are sadly misinformed, and too full of errors and conjecture to warrant a productive response.
"Jeff A. Taylor" obviously didn't hear the quote correctly, although he certainly is capable of multiplying by 1.61. The costs quoted by Morris have been vetted by hundreds around the world, including some of the largest engineering firms in the world. But if Jeff wants a trolley, or perhaps an untested theoretical model...or even just more lanes, so be it.
I'll give Morris a chance to prove his numbers.
I did read your posts and addressed your observations point by point.
If you have stations/stops at logical points along a heavily developed transit corridor it would be vitually impossible to have speeds of more than 60 MPH.
We are talking about a transit system that serves or will serve a densely developed corridor not one that is traveling through the French or German countryside.
I doubt transit vehicles, regardless of their speed capabilities, would be able to reach high speeds (over 60 MPH) except for those stretches where stations are widely spaced and the tracks are straight.
Besides it it is frequency of vehicle availabilty (headways) that is the important issue, not the speed. So I would be more concerned with how long I have to wait for the next train more than I would how fast it goes once I am on it.
Of course you are right about cars being able to go faster than 60MPH, but I wouldn't try that at rush hour on I-75, which is when we need transit the most.
Does HighRoad have a working prototype in operation somewhere?
If not, the concept is purely theoretical and the costs are based on drawings and specific assumptions not on actual in-the- ground construction.
And as far as the Cobb DOT is concerned I wouldn't trust their opinion on construction costs as far as I could throw them. Particularly on complex transit systems. You shouldn't either.
From what I read in the MDJ article, Mr. Morris has a full size, operational track and vehicle out in the Powder Springs area.
And the only time I berated you was when you made the ridiculous comment about whether the system would run vehicles in opposite directions at the same time.
I apologize, but I don't suffer dumb comments like that very well.
@Get Real - how fast do cars travel under rush hour conditions? Like I said, I'm not a proponent of tax dollars paying for public transit, but 60 is still faster than 10 to 15 mph in a car during rush hour, right?
Honestly this is the first I've heard of the HighRoad system... looking into it now...
I'll be in looking into these numbers some more at my blog...
No, I'm not a Chamber or CID operative, nor a MARTA supporter, nor a member of the KGB. I'm just a guy who thinks 60 mph isn't fast enough since cars travel at LEAST that fast anyway under normal conditions and that maglev is more about the oooh-aaaaahh factor than real solutions to traffic congestion.
I'm a fan of another Cobb-based solution, the HighRoad system, that I believe stands to move MORE people at a faster rate and has actually accurate costs behind both its construction and operation plan. Mr Ott knows that the HR construction cost has been validated by CDOT. My questions of the previous post stand. (Please READ my post before spending the time to berate me for something I haven't said!)
Transit IS needed to help solve (along with roads projects) the congestion problems in Cobb and across the norther arc. It just needs to be a realistic, effective solution that will be attractive to current drivers.